DarkLordOfOptics
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Prismatic Discussion with Everyday Marksman

Matt has posted the audio only version of last week's discussion of prismatic scopes and a brief written summary https://www.everydaymarksman.co/podcast/prism-primer/

There are a couple of things there that I thought I should clarify and add some specificity, because I have not tested all prismatics out there.

One is the statement that under $1k I would take one of the modern prismatics over any LPVO. That is generally true, although I do make an exception for the Delta Stryker 1-6x24. It is well built and has a nuclear bright fiber dot for an aiming point. I also happen to like Steiner P4Xi 1-4x24 for the same reasons. The Tract 1-8x24 is growing on me, but it is over $1k.

In general, however, with LPVOs, I very strongly prefer FFP models. I tend to need drop and wind holds quite frequently and I often shoot on intermediate magnifications. The least expensive currently available FFP LPVO that I recommend is probably SAI 1-6x24 https://bit.ly/3mOjBoE (by the way, the introduced a 7.62 BDC reticle option). There are less expensive FFP LPVOs out there, but the ones I have seen did not impress me enough to recommend them. Perhaps, there is something out there I have not seen that are good enough, but I can't speak to that. Obviously.

Another important thing to emphasize is that we are talking about general tactical use on semi-auto platforms like ARs and AKs. If, for example, we are talking about hunting use behind clip-ons there is a lot to be said about good quality SFP LPVOs. Quite a few clip-ons out there are designed to attach to the objective of conventional scopes. That's how I use Steiner P4Xi 1-4x24 and Tract Toric 1-8x24, for example.

If a thermal clip-on has a picatinny mount, it can usually be lined up in front of a compact prismatic and 2x/3x prismatics do work well with most commercial clip-ons. For example, Burris' RT-3 works very nicely with Burris' BTC-50 thermal clip-on (https://bit.ly/3E1bb2w). Now, that I have been spending some time with different clip-ons, however, I find that with QVGA clip-ons (the ones with 384x288 or similar resolution), I am perfectly happy using them with 2x/3x prismatics. However, with higher resolution VGA clip-ons, while the full field of view is with the scope on ~2x, there is enough resolution to zoom in up to 4x/5x when I am ready to pull the trigger. That's one of the reasons I use an LPVO with Steiner's C35. Between the higher resolution core and very effective image processing, I have enough resolution to zoom in a little. Same goes for the iRay Micro RH25 when used as a clip-on, although with its wider FOV, there is also a benefit to dialing magnification down a little.

One of the things we really discussed with Matt was how much performance modern inexpensive prismatics offer if you are on a budget. Well, if you are on a budget, you might not be looking at thermals all that much. Even budget thermals, if you want something half way decent, are a lot of money.

Before I list the specific prismatics, it is also worth mentioning that with fixed power scopes, for rapid close range performance, you are relying on an offset or piggybacked red dot. If you have sever astigmatism, that might not work for you. In that case, LPVO is your best bet.

Going back to prismatics, the word "budget" is really key here. When we are talking about modern prismatics, we are talking about scopes in the $300 to $500 range. For that money, compared to similarly priced LPVOs, you are getting lighter weight, better image quality, wider FOV and, potentially, better durability. Compared to more expensive LPVOs, you are usually getting better FOV, lighter weight and lower price.

Here are the 2x and higher prismatics that have impressed me in the last couple of years:
PA GLx 2x for $369 https://bit.ly/3vWrUks
PA SLx Micro 3x for $320 https://bit.ly/3KuU7oL
Burris RT-3 3x for $379 https://bit.ly/3yrNUpF
SwampFox Trihawk 3x for $250 https://bit.ly/3uUhxvP
Vortex Spitfire Gen2 5x for $450 https://bit.ly/3ASliZJ
SwampFox Saber 5x for $390 https://www.swampfoxoptics.com/saber-prism-scope-5x36

SwampFox Trihawk and Saber are large prism scopes, so they are comparatively heavy at 17 and 25 ounces respectively. However, even the just released 25 ounce Saber is in the same weight range as an LPVO with mount for less money and with a much more immersive FOV.

The others are rather small and trim designs. I am particularly partial to the 2x GLx from Primary Arms.

To re-iterate, none of these are as good as my Elcan Spetre 4x, but they are a better bang for the buck.

If I was building a starter 5.56 AR for one of my nephews today, for example (their ARs have LPVOs on them), they probably would end up with PA's 3x SLx or SwampFox Trihawk on them and an offset red dot.

For starter AKs or 300Blackout ARs, it would probably be PA's GLx 2x with a red dot.

For a budget large frame AR, I might lean toward a little more magnification and go with one of the 5x options.

Equally critically, these recent advancements with prismatics are not over. There is more coming. I'll release information as soon as I am able to.

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AR-15 Handguards with integrated Arca rail

I had a couple of ARs I wanted to set up for long range training. There is more to do with them, but I started out by swapping out the handguards for models with an integrated full length Arca rail. Larger flat on the bottom of the handguard helps it settle on the sandbag and makes it easier to shoot off of a tripod. I also found the ability to slide the bipod to different positions occasionally helpful.

The two handguards I have been testing are:

Fast Track my Catalyst Arms: https://www.anarchyoutdoors.com/fast-track-arca-precision-rifle-handguard-ar-15-rpr-only/?ref=fl0iza41

IWI/CMT HDM https://alnk.to/8iWcTQE

Both work well once installed, but IWI/CMT was ultimately less of a hassle to get properly lined up.

Fasttrack barrel nut arrangement is a little goofy and getting properly lined up took some trial and error. Here is the video they made that shows how it is set up. I was going to do my own, but once I got it all aligned, I did not want to mess with taking it up and ...

00:19:29
Burris XTR PS Wrap-Up

The first Burris XTR PS scope I got my hands on landed here in the beginning of March.
That means I have been messing with this design for a bit under four months. That does not quite qualify as a long term test by my standards, but it is a fair amount of time and quite a few rounds shot, mostly 5.56 and 308.
I have both of the models of XTR PS and both work well.
https://alnk.to/3U3cZEC

For matches and such, I would lean toward the 5.5-30x56 version, but for general purpose use, the smaller 3.3-18x50 model does have an edge. You can shoot a match with it, take it hunting in the mountains or slap a thermal clip-on in front to go shoot some pigs. While not light weight, it is a very flexible design owing to moderate size and mid-pack magnification range.

As I said in the video, I think XTR PS is a meaningful step forward in simplifying how we shoot at distance.

I will provide occasional updates as I continue using the scope.

00:26:02
5x Prismatic Wrap-up

This is not the end of my commentary on 5x prismatics, but it is a wrap for an unintentionally very long term project I had. I spent an unhealthy amount of time evaluating these four prismatic riflescopes:
Element Immersive 5x30 https://alnk.to/gzXEPUr
Swampfox Sabre 5x36 https://alnk.to/aAPTubq
Vortex Spitfire Gen2 5x https://alnk.to/3co4hVD
Primary Arms SLx 5x https://alnk.to/2jOhnT7

Two are large prism designs. Two are small prism designs.

The order in which I list them above corresponds to the image quality, from best to worst, although there isn't a ton of difference between SLx and Spitfire Gen2. Purely on the merits of resolution, Sabre is comparable to them as well, but much wider FOV and forgiving eyebox does put it a step above in terms of performance (at the expense of about a pound of weight). Element Immersive 5x30 is a different beast optically and it should be at a higher price at which it sells. It resolves better, has higher contrast and widest FOV of the bunch. Side-focus adds ...

00:16:40

Leupold Scope dump at CDNN.

I just got an email, multiple models and reticles for 3HD, 4HD and 5HD scopes. You need call to get prices.

https://www.cdnnsports.com/optics.html?manufacturer=LEUPOLD

Independence Day, 2025

Publishing a "Happy Independence Day!" a day after independence day is probably bad form. It is also bad for posting affiliate links. Everybody and their grandmother is having discounts and I am not posting any links. To be honest, I do not particularly like posting general links and I simply did not have time to dig through everything and come with specific product links.
Still, if you plan to be buying something from one of the retailers I have an affiliate account with, I would appreciate it if you were to start with one of my links listed in the FAQ: https://darklordofoptics.locals.com/faq

I started writing the more substantive part of this post yesterday, but got sidetracked with thinking about the origin of the ideas that make America and ran out of time. I was only able to get back to it now. I suppose, better late than never.

We live in the world that, as far as the details go, is dramatically different from the world of the founders of the United States.

For the majority of this ...

July 04, 2025

This is a good deal:

https://alnk.to/c0a5bf9

Scoping Gas Guns
an interesting question that acme in via PM

I received this question via a private message and thought it was interesting enough to answer it in some detail.  I have been thinking a lot about appropriate optics for gas guns recently, so this came it at the right time.

 

Here is what I ahve been messing with last few days:

 

Above: 18" WOA barrel 5.56 AR-15 with Burris XTR PS 5.5-30x56 on it.

Below: 22" Satern barrel 224Valkyrie AR-15 with Delta Stryker 3.5-21x44 on it.


For obvious reasons, I am not posting who asked the question, but what I'll do is send him a link to this article, so that he gets an answer and we might have a good discussion.
Here is what I received:

Had a question for you
I have a Knights Armament SR25 6.5CM with a 14.5" barrel - I plan on shooting 100 - 600 yards at targets at 100 yd intervals
I am favoring the TT 315P with an Aimpont Acro mounted on top -( see you liked the TT315M) - would that be enough magnification?
I saw the SB SB 5-20 which offer more top end - I like the turrets on the Tanget and tooless Zero - what are your thoughts between the 2?
If I stayed 400 and under - how do you see the TT315P with the Acro Red dot against the SB 1-8 Short Dot (saw your review on that)

There isn't really enough information in the question for a simple answer, so let's consider a couple of options.

What is the gun for? 

For shooting medium range (out to 600) with occasional close range use?  If yes, go with a conventional scope and offset or piggybacked RDS.

For shooting at close distance with occasional med/long range use? If yes, so with a nice LPVO like the above mentioned S&B Short Dot 1-8x24 https://alnk.to/3J8vlFv.  It is quite capable at long range, but where it will really knock your socks off is up close and personal.

The question of what is enough magnification is pretty personal.  For me, 3-15x is plenty, but I shoot a lot off of the tripod and off of barricades which likely influences my decision.  For that, my 3-15x50 TT315M Tangent works great and 6mrad of elevation is plenty.  https://alnk.to/gVNkUXB  175gr #08 out of a shoter tube will drop in the 5 to 5.5mrad range at 600 yards.

For a dedicated long range semi-auto, other than the looks, there isn't much downside to a larger scope, which is why I set up Burris' XTR PS on the 5.56 AR pictured above.  It is for my son to learn to shoot at distance and to us in next year's BOTC match.  https://alnk.to/gp33YuR

If I were setting up an accurate semi-auto and wanted a high mag scope for it, I would likely lean toward March 4.5-28x52. https://alnk.to/dLjHgjh  It is compact, relatively light and very good optically for any use other than the dead of the night (for which we should be using clip-ons anyway).

S&B Short Dot is a very nice scope, but March is a newer design and, other than the lowest light, has an edge in terms of image fidelity and stray light control.

TT315P Tangent is a veyr ncie scope and toolles turrets are appealing.  However, there is a weight penalty to that.  For me, that was not worth it.  I ahve 5-25x56 and 7-35x Tangents and those toolless turrets are spectacular.  However, in a 3-15x50, I am quit ecomfortable with simpler 6mrad per turn knobs on the TT315M.

 

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A morning with a chronograph

When I tell people that I am using Hornady's factory ammo for matches, I get occasionally surprised looks.  Occasionally.  Most of the time, I get fairly condescending looks from handloaders who would not let a factory round pollute the chambers of their precision rifles if their lives depended on it.

To be fair, if I had the time, I might be reloading as well.  I might be able to do better than modern factory ammo, but the truth is that I am not a quarter MOA shooter, so a lot of that would be lost on me.  The UKD matches I fidn most interesting can be done by a competent shooter with a 1MOA gun.  I am working on that first part.  I reload when I have to, but if I can get factory ammo that's not outrageously expensive and that shoots well, I will go with that every time.

I looked around and realized that I have about 600 rounds of Hornady 147gr 6.5CM factory ammo from two lots.  400 rounds from one that I will use during the match later this month.  The remainder I will likely use up practicing prior to that.

I woke up early and snuck out to the range while my family was still asleep earlier today.

I set up in the 100 yard tunnel we have.  I took my four shots to zero with the lot I plan to use for the match.  Then I fired a six shot ~0.7MOA group.  That's accurate enough for my purposes.

Here are the chronograph results:

It is slow, but accurate and consistent.

Then I shot a five round group of Hornady 147gr ammo from the other lot.

Both of those lots are not too shabby for factory ammo.  POI was within 0.2mrad between the two lots, all laterally.  

 

I had some other ammo on hand, so I fired two five shot groups with Berger 144gr hybrid target ammo and Sako TRG 136gr.

Here is what I got for five rounds of Berger:

That's not a ton of statistics, but it is a data point.  The group was ~1.1MOA

 

Here the data for the Sako TRG 136gr ammo:

This ammo showed some mild pressure signs, but not too significant.  

Again, this is not a ton of data, but Hornady is looking pretty decent here.

I'll repeat the zero retention and consistency tests a couple more times between now and June 18th when we head to Wyoming.

I might pick up a couple more boxes of Hornady 147gr from a different lot to get some more data.

More to come.

 

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First PRS Match is behind me
High Noon at Del Norte

My first PRS match is officially behind me.  It was, I think an officially sanctioned regional PRS match at the shooting range called Del Norte about an hour from me (just east of Rio Rancho).
As I discussed previously, rather than using the rifle I originally prepared for it, I ended up having to change gears at the last moment and slapping a 5-25x56 Tangent on my daughter's 6ARC MiniFIx.  A lightweight 16" Proof barreled 6ARC is not an ideal set up for PRS competition, but, in the grand scheme of things, the rifle did hot hold me back at all.  I had a couple of weights that fit the Q-cert handguard, so I slapped them on there as well, which got the rifle to right around 12lbs.  The balance point was almost where I want it, but not quite.  In all other ways, this was a very handy rifle to shoot.  I am actually thinking of getting a couple more weights that I can stack on it (Sawtooth weights are stackable), so that I can shoot some future local matches with it.  It shoots Hornady's Black 105gr ammo very well (it also shoots 108gr ELD-M and 103gr ELD-X well, but I had a larger supply of Hornady Black ammo on hand).

It chrono'ed pretty consistently for factory ammo.  Here are the measurements for a 20 shot group.

If I were to take out the fastest shot, SD drops down to 8fps.  

In terms of wind performance, it is a 5mph rifle, so slightly better than the 308 ammo I was going to use originally, but not as good as the 6.5CM that was my intended match rifle for this year (we make plans, but then life happens).

I do have to admit that I really enjoyed shooting the match with the MiniFix.  So much so, that I am seriously thinking of building another one for myself, since this rifle is technically my daughter's.

The closest shot we had was a bit over a couple of hundred yards.  The furthest was around 1150.  That was a bit challenging for the 16" barreled 6ARC, especially since the terrain there is tricky and wind is doing strange things.  Morning was relatively quiet wind-wise, but then the wind becamse gusty with changing directions.

It was a one day match with about 30 shooters (six squads) and ten stages.  The 17 year old kid who won the match was in my squad with his dad.  Apparently he is on the US team, so it should not be surrpising that he won.  He was very good.

Overall level of the shooters in the match was quite good.  I really was not sure what to expect.  Somewhat paradoxically, the only matches that I have shot in so far are the much larger two day NRL Hunter matches.  In those, I am just out of the bottom third in terms of skill level.  In this match, it was pretty much in the same spot, I think.  

The terrain was a little bit like Cameo, I think (I have been there, but not shot there), with some angle changes and sufficient vegetation to make getting on target occasionally troublesome. 

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