DarkLordOfOptics
Politics • Science & Tech • Sports
Guns, Optics, 2nd Amendment and resisting the Left in everything they touch.
Interested? Want to learn more about the community?

Learn more first
Starter Precision Scope

This question comes up again and again. It usually goes something like this: "I want to start shooting PRS/NRL/plates far away/etc. I just bought a {insert you favourite brand} rifle and enough reloading supplies for my great grandchildren to grow up unconcerned about ammo. I want to get a scope. What should I get?"
When facing this question, I always avoid answering it right off the bat and spend some time trying to figure out two things:
-is this person new to shooting or just new to precision rifle?
-what is the real budget?
Both questions are important and related to each other. If they are new to shooting, chances are they think they can get a good precision scope for a couple of hundred bucks having bought, hook line and sinker, the basic argument made by all the budget bullshit brands on Amazon (Monstrum, Shmonstrum, Feyachi, NcStar, etc) that they are just as good as the well known brands except for less money. They are not. Every once in a while they make a good one and the euphoric owner of that rare specimen spends every waking moment proclaiming on every online forum that his Huyachi Special is so good, he sold all eighty of his Schmidt and Benders that he has been using since kindergarten. On one hand, I do not discount that there are a few of these that are actually decent out there. On the other hand, I know that many of these glowing reviews are not exactly honest. I have been approached most of these brands more than once. They offer free product and additional money per review (or per views) if I say nice things about them. I always tell them to go pound sand, sometimes I even do it politely. However, some very basic arithmetic suggests that I could make a decent living by sneaking in a few bullshit reviews and pushing brands that have high affiliate commissions. I find it to be more than a little unethical, but that opinion is not shared by the rank and file of the internet influencers out there. If you pay attention, you can easily figure out who these guys are. They are not the only type of an influencer that's for sale, but I'll cover the other ones in some future article. To be fair, I am probably for sale too, I just happen to be really expensive and no sane optics company is likely to be willing to pay that much. If one ever pops up that is willing to write me a check that big, I will probably refuse to have anything to do with them because they are obviously insane.

But, I digress...

When faced with the question of which scope to start with, the most important and difficult thing to figure out is whether this whole precision shooting business is a fad for whoever I am talking to or whether they are likely to stick with it. I am not going to recommend crap either way, but I will recommend something different if I do not think they will stick with it.
The difficult part, is that when they send me a link to the latest and greatest Monstrum paperweight and I tell them it is a steaming pile of manure and buying crap ends up costing more in the long term, they simply do not believe me. Half the time, they just want someone to confirm their preconceived notion and they will keep asking different people the same question until they get the answer they want. The other half of the time, they ask a perfectly honest question, but often have a hard time spending that much money.
For those people, the standard answer for quite a few years now has been one of SWFA's fixed power riflescopes (10x42 or 12x42 would be my pick) and that answer has not changed. Not yet. Several chinese made scopes are trying to challenge that (Vortex Venom, Arken SH4, Element Helix FFP) and, honestly, they are fairly convincing, but there are a couple of problems.
First of all, they still do not quite have the track record. I like all three of these designs from what I have seen so far and I started tracking all sorts of anecdotal evidence on how consistent they are. So far so good, but I do run into some evidence of spotty QC with Arken. Hopefully, it is just growing pains, but that's why I track these things. I do not know Arken OEM particularly well, which makes things more complicated for me. I know who builds Helix for Element, so it is easier for me to have faith in the mechanics of that scope. Either way, the way I look at these for now, they are great backup scopes or rimfire scopes for someone who already has something nicer and has some experience in terms of what works and what doesn't.
If you are new at this, you should not be taking chances and experimenting. There will be plenty of things to go wrong and one of the main things you are looking for in your first precision optic is that it does not become something that trips you up. Now, nothing in this world is truly guaranteed, so we are playing percentages here.
The second factor is that as inexpensive as these latest offerings from Vortex, Arken and Element are, they are still typically in the $450-$500 range. Fixed power SWFA SS Classic is $300. We all very desensitized by how much fancy riflescopes cost, but if you are new at this and shopping on a budget, the difference between the two is a decent set of rings and a few accessories. It is easy for me to say: "just spend extra few hundred dollars" when it is not my money being spent.
Given all that, what should you be looking for in your first precision scope? Honestly, if you have the budget for it, you should be stepping up to the $1500-$2000 range and picking up something along the lines of Vortex Razor Gen2 4.5-27x56, Element Nexus 5-20x50, Delta Stryker 4.5-30x56, Tract Toric UHD 4.5-30x56, Athlon Cronus 4.5-29x56, etc. These are high quality full featured Japanese-made scopes with good reputation for durability. Equally importantly, they come from companies that will support you if something goes wrong. That is a lot of money though.
Now that they have been out for a bit, I am becoming more comfortable with higher end mostly chinese scopes in the $1000 range. They look to be holding up quite well. These scopes like Athlon Ares ETR 4.5-30x56 and Meopta Optika6 5-30x56, Delta Javelin 4.5-30x56, etc. These are still not cheap, but notably less.
If you really are on a budget or if you are just testing the waters trying to figure out if this hobby is for you, you should be shopping on the used market. That way if you change your mind you can sell the optic and mostly be even. Or just buy that SWFA Classic for $300. It does not have all the bells and whistles, but it stays zeroed and tracks true. If you have to sell it, you'll be out no more than $40.

All my standard recommendations are compiled here:, by price range: https://opticsthoughts.com/?page_id=623
If you can think of a category I missed, please let me know.

Interested? Want to learn more about the community?

Learn more first
What else you may like…
Videos
Posts
Articles
Vortex Defender XL Green

This is the second time Vortex' Defender XL crosses my path. I was very impressed with the original red dot version, so I was curious to see how the one with the green dot works for my eyes.
To get the details, see the attached video.
The cliff's notes version is that I am just as impressed with this one. In terms of collimation quality and parallax control, it is quite exceptional.
https://alnk.to/881BEV1

00:10:20
Primary Arms HTX-1 US Made red dot sight

I've had this RDS for a bit over two months now and I am beyond pleased with it.
Despite some spirited abuse, it keeps soldiering on.
https://alnk.to/1C9z5dw
It is a very nice RDS and being fully made in the US does not hurt either.

00:13:03
Delta Stryker 3.5-21x44 Wrap-up

This scope comes up a lot since I really like the configuration. It is time to do a final wrap-up of it.

It is one of my favourite scopes on the market today, especially for the money, since I naturally lean toward general purpose-ish designs. Still, while the 3.5-21x44 Stryker is relatively compact and light, it still clearly leans toward the precision side of things, which suites me very well.

https://annexdefense.com/optics-and-optic-accessories/delta-optics/

00:10:25
Had to switch to a different streaming service

Rumble Studio crapped out on me. so I hadd to stream using a different service

Well, imagine THAT....

I wonder if all of the Youtube frauds who spent the last few weeks shamelessly lying for clicks are going to go apologize to Sig now.

https://taskandpurpose.com/news/air-force-m18-arrest/

Area 419 and Odinworks Muzzlebrakes raffle

Just a reminder: on Tuesday, August 12th at around 7pm, Aaron and I will go over out impressions from the TRT Sniper Challenge in a bit more detail. We have the course of fire, so we'll go over how the stages were set up and the challenges presented by this rather unusual (by my standards match).

Somewhere half way through the livestream, I will raffle off a couple of items I picked up off of the prize table.

One is the Area 419 Hellfire Competition brake.

The other is a tunable brake from Odinworks.

The pictures for both are attached.

In order to enter the raffle, you have to be a member of this community (darklordofoptics.locals.com). You do not have to be a paying supporter. A free account is enough for this.

If you would like to enter the raffle, send me an email with the following information:
-the item you are going for (Area419 or Odinworks)
-your username from this Locals community

send the email to [email protected]

I will accept entries until ~8PM on ...

post photo preview
Steiner C35 Gen2 Mount
from Annex Defense

The production version of the Annex Defense's mount for the Steiner C35 Gen2 thermal Clip-on is finally here.  At $1600 (when this is published), the clip-on is an absolute steal.

I've had it for a few days, but, me being the good old paranoid me, I spent some time shooting with it before posting anything.  I had a couple of days with it prior to last weekend's match in Montana and a couple of days after.  Another to pop it on and off a few times and get a couple of hundred rounds of 6.5Grendel through the gun to see if anything shakes loose.  So far so good.

The C35 Gen2 clip-on is sitting on my 6.5Grendel AR as a part of a long running "Only One" project that I have.  It pairs perfectly with the Steiner H6Xi 2-12x42 scope.

Here is what comes in the box from Annex Defense:

The order in which the whole thing comes togethe is pretty stragihtforward:

-slide the thermal washer onto the threaded interface extending out of the back of the clip-on

-spin the mount itself onto the threaded interface (the mount is threaded on the inside) until it can go no further

-rotate the mount so that the clip-on is properly lined up to the picatinny clamp

-once you are happy with the alignment, use the three nylon tipped set screws (you'll need an allen wrench for that) to lock in the position of the clip-on in the mount.  You need very little torque on the set screws.  They are there for one reason and one reason only: to keep the mount from spinning when you tighten the timing nut in the next step

-spin the timing nut onto the threaded interface of the clip-on to lock the mount in place.  You should not need the timing nut wrench, but one is in there just in case.

Here are the pieces laid out in the order in which you will need them.

When you are done, it should look like this:

Note that the mount normaly comes with two T20 screws.  I am using two thumbscrews instead, since I am popping the mount on and off all the time.  It seems to be staying put with the thumbscrews just fine.  I am hoping Annex will offer the thumbscrews as an option.

It is not quite an equivalent of a QD mount, but we needed something with an extremely low profile clamp to fit under scopes with fairly large objectives.  As is, the mount works with most scope that have objective lens diameter of 50mm or less.

I am using with with Steiner H6Xi 2-12x42 and the two work together exceedingly well.

Read full Article
Scoping Gas Guns
an interesting question that acme in via PM

I received this question via a private message and thought it was interesting enough to answer it in some detail.  I have been thinking a lot about appropriate optics for gas guns recently, so this came it at the right time.

 

Here is what I ahve been messing with last few days:

 

Above: 18" WOA barrel 5.56 AR-15 with Burris XTR PS 5.5-30x56 on it.

Below: 22" Satern barrel 224Valkyrie AR-15 with Delta Stryker 3.5-21x44 on it.


For obvious reasons, I am not posting who asked the question, but what I'll do is send him a link to this article, so that he gets an answer and we might have a good discussion.
Here is what I received:

Had a question for you
I have a Knights Armament SR25 6.5CM with a 14.5" barrel - I plan on shooting 100 - 600 yards at targets at 100 yd intervals
I am favoring the TT 315P with an Aimpont Acro mounted on top -( see you liked the TT315M) - would that be enough magnification?
I saw the SB SB 5-20 which offer more top end - I like the turrets on the Tanget and tooless Zero - what are your thoughts between the 2?
If I stayed 400 and under - how do you see the TT315P with the Acro Red dot against the SB 1-8 Short Dot (saw your review on that)

There isn't really enough information in the question for a simple answer, so let's consider a couple of options.

What is the gun for? 

For shooting medium range (out to 600) with occasional close range use?  If yes, go with a conventional scope and offset or piggybacked RDS.

For shooting at close distance with occasional med/long range use? If yes, so with a nice LPVO like the above mentioned S&B Short Dot 1-8x24 https://alnk.to/3J8vlFv.  It is quite capable at long range, but where it will really knock your socks off is up close and personal.

The question of what is enough magnification is pretty personal.  For me, 3-15x is plenty, but I shoot a lot off of the tripod and off of barricades which likely influences my decision.  For that, my 3-15x50 TT315M Tangent works great and 6mrad of elevation is plenty.  https://alnk.to/gVNkUXB  175gr #08 out of a shoter tube will drop in the 5 to 5.5mrad range at 600 yards.

For a dedicated long range semi-auto, other than the looks, there isn't much downside to a larger scope, which is why I set up Burris' XTR PS on the 5.56 AR pictured above.  It is for my son to learn to shoot at distance and to us in next year's BOTC match.  https://alnk.to/gp33YuR

If I were setting up an accurate semi-auto and wanted a high mag scope for it, I would likely lean toward March 4.5-28x52. https://alnk.to/dLjHgjh  It is compact, relatively light and very good optically for any use other than the dead of the night (for which we should be using clip-ons anyway).

S&B Short Dot is a very nice scope, but March is a newer design and, other than the lowest light, has an edge in terms of image fidelity and stray light control.

TT315P Tangent is a veyr ncie scope and toolles turrets are appealing.  However, there is a weight penalty to that.  For me, that was not worth it.  I ahve 5-25x56 and 7-35x Tangents and those toolless turrets are spectacular.  However, in a 3-15x50, I am quit ecomfortable with simpler 6mrad per turn knobs on the TT315M.

 

Read full Article
A morning with a chronograph

When I tell people that I am using Hornady's factory ammo for matches, I get occasionally surprised looks.  Occasionally.  Most of the time, I get fairly condescending looks from handloaders who would not let a factory round pollute the chambers of their precision rifles if their lives depended on it.

To be fair, if I had the time, I might be reloading as well.  I might be able to do better than modern factory ammo, but the truth is that I am not a quarter MOA shooter, so a lot of that would be lost on me.  The UKD matches I fidn most interesting can be done by a competent shooter with a 1MOA gun.  I am working on that first part.  I reload when I have to, but if I can get factory ammo that's not outrageously expensive and that shoots well, I will go with that every time.

I looked around and realized that I have about 600 rounds of Hornady 147gr 6.5CM factory ammo from two lots.  400 rounds from one that I will use during the match later this month.  The remainder I will likely use up practicing prior to that.

I woke up early and snuck out to the range while my family was still asleep earlier today.

I set up in the 100 yard tunnel we have.  I took my four shots to zero with the lot I plan to use for the match.  Then I fired a six shot ~0.7MOA group.  That's accurate enough for my purposes.

Here are the chronograph results:

It is slow, but accurate and consistent.

Then I shot a five round group of Hornady 147gr ammo from the other lot.

Both of those lots are not too shabby for factory ammo.  POI was within 0.2mrad between the two lots, all laterally.  

 

I had some other ammo on hand, so I fired two five shot groups with Berger 144gr hybrid target ammo and Sako TRG 136gr.

Here is what I got for five rounds of Berger:

That's not a ton of statistics, but it is a data point.  The group was ~1.1MOA

 

Here the data for the Sako TRG 136gr ammo:

This ammo showed some mild pressure signs, but not too significant.  

Again, this is not a ton of data, but Hornady is looking pretty decent here.

I'll repeat the zero retention and consistency tests a couple more times between now and June 18th when we head to Wyoming.

I might pick up a couple more boxes of Hornady 147gr from a different lot to get some more data.

More to come.

 

Read full Article
Available on mobile and TV devices
google store google store app store app store
google store google store app tv store app tv store amazon store amazon store roku store roku store
Powered by Locals